OK, so there are features that perform properly in one ‘canvas’ but not in another. That was my perception when starting to use OpenGL in v4.0.7 and hence my suggestion of a table that would summarize these problems. My objective in starting this thread was certainly not to suggest that one ‘canvas’ or another is defective overall and should be chucked in the trash-can (see quote below). That would be like throwing-the-baby-out-with-the-bathwater.
Rather, it’d be better to have a ‘cheat sheet’ that serves as a sanity check when the user stumbles across some odd GUI performance. Much better that, than staring at the screen pondering, “Hey, what happened to the […name here…] command?”
I was talking about v5 unless explicitly stated. There probably will be users who are forced to continue with v4 for a while. But I bet that after getting a taste of v5 everyone wants to upgrade. There would be no reason to make a checklist for v5 because you would just check everything for GAL (OpenGL & Cairo), and Legacy isn’t needed at all. Basically Legacy is the same as v4 Default, without changes (I don’t know if something has changed, but as far as I understand the development was ceased after v4).
So there would be only v4 Default vs. v4 GAL, two columns, and v5 should be left out because it does everything anyways, and then some more. I don’t see why anyone would bother doing that for v4 because it will be obsoleted so soon. I can be wrong, of course, and if someone wants to do it, go ahead, maybe someone needs it.
Hello, 'Eelik"
Thanks for clarifying that you were referring to V5. On the other hand, I started out this thread by stating that I was using V4.0.7, and that I was new to KiCad. I have not tried to shift over to the KiCad beta-version (V5 “nightly builds” etc) as that’s a work in progress. Learning new software while that software is undergoing metamorphosis would be like attempting to build a house on a sand dune during a wind storm. I would’ve thought that someone (presumably one of the Developers) has their own cheat-sheet or check-list of issues that they want to / need to address as they migrate from one Build to another. I was hoping that this could be shared.
Right now nightly builds are very close to the final 5.0. Only bugfixes are still added. For a beginner who has no valuable projects yet, now is good time to start with nightly builds.
Alright…I will take your word on this.
As I have V4.0.7 installed currently… I assume I have to do an Uninstall of KiCad 4.0.7 and then download and install the current (nightly) build of KiCad…right? Are there any libraries and files that I have to manually delete?
I am guessing here that the Nightly Build is a complete installation package, and not akin to “windows update” installer.
Also you have to be aware that you have to migrate projects made with v4 to v5 and then you can’t migrate them back. I you are just playing with projects for practice you can do the migration or start new projects. If you have something which you want to get finalized you could do it with v4 or migrate a copy and try to go on with v5.
So, there is a tool within KiCad V5 (i.e., the currently nightly build…!) that migrates old V4 KiCad files? I am assuming here that a big part of the migration process is the automated replacement of all the old footprints (and symbols?) with ones from the new Libraries which are in a different graphics format?
If switching entirely to v5, when uninstalling v4 also remember to wipe out the C:\Users<username>\AppData\Roaming\kicad user settings folder, or at least change the folder name so the new v5 KiCad can’t find it. That should give you the best “starting from square one” experience.
Footprints have been and are embedded in the pcb file and they don’t need migration. You don’t need to update them, the old ones are compatible with v5. You can update them manually if you feel so, but it has to be done one by one and you have to find the corresponding new footprint yourself if the name doesn’t match.
The built-in migration is for the schematic. It has caused some headache for me but it should be automatic if you have correct new configuration and libraries installed (I had some problems because of earlier installs).
Hmmm. Ok, that one should go over to V5 immediately if you are a newbie does seem to be the consensus. My only criticism (now) is that, the kicad.org site’s reference to V4.0.7 as “the stable build” should now come with a caveat / warning aimed at those entirely new to KiCad. Starting new into KiCad, one would not normally (to my mind…) spend much, if any, time reviewing all the various Forum discussions to know that V4.0.7 is really not the best flavour for the Newbie.
Hello, Eelik:
I just un-installed V4.0.7, and installed the latest Nightly (“V5”). Here is what I found…
None of the old footprints in my PcbNew were updated automatically.
The footprints I created and put in a separate folder, were not preserved (not a big surprise) and I had to recreate them (only 2 so far, not a big deal).
I reviewed the schematic, and the schematic seems to have come across (migrated) correctly, with the exception of the custom symbols I had added and their associated footprints (now fixed).
I recreated the Netlist and, when returning to PcbNew, I imported that Netlist. I also ran the “Update all footprints on Board” command. The fact is, none of the 3d models appear in the 3d view.
At least one of the now-missing footprints does not have a *.wrl file in the new Library.
It seems that a significant number of 3d shape files that exist in the previous Library, are no longer in the new (V5, Nightly) release.
and 3. Do you have correct sym-lib-table and fp-lib-table entries in the project? Where that separate folder is?
I don’t use 3D much so I didn’t remember this. The v4 footprints have references to the v4 3d files and the file structure/names have changed. And, again, footprints aren’t updated in any way when migrating.
@Rene_Poschl may be able to help further with library issues. I’m afraid these kind of issues will be massive when people will begin to migrate after 5.0 is released. It’s good we find them now, and it’s good there are people who can try nightly builds with non-critical projects. Sorry about making you a guinea-pig You can always re-install v4 if you feel need.
More specifically, footprints in existing designs (PCBnew files) aren’t automatically updated. You can manually update them yourself within PCBnew, but watch out for the footprints themselves moving. The footprints in the libraries will be updated. The pointer to the 3D models are part of the footprint. (Note the 3D model itself isn’t part of the footprint, only a pointer to another file.)
This comment (below) is consistent with what I have seen so far:
I am not sure what “low quality” in the comment below mean here:
I had in fact used some TO-5 components and several axial-lead tantalum caps. Those have disappeared from my 3d view. I have not cross-checked to see if they are in the new Library / Footprint / 3d Model files.
In terms of “waiting for a volunteer to do them justice”, do you feel that’s a task that can be automated using a script?
I am not sure what you mean in this reply. I understand that it is possible to convert the formats etc. But do you feel that this has to be done one-at-a-time, or can they be batch processed (at least through part of the entire process)?
WRL can not be converted into step. that is why the models have been dropped.
So the only option is to make new models directly in some tool that can create step files.
You asked if there is a script to do them justice. This repo contains said scripts.
Out of curiosity, I decided to install a nightly freshly on a system that never had KiCad before (just like a new user). I used the default installation settings so no environment variables were set. I found a bug with paths in the configure paths window. I’ve reported this bug here: https://bugs.launchpad.net/kicad/+bug/1777346
Just thought I would give a heads up for fresh installs, turn on the set environment variables setting in the installer. At least for now.
This discussion will be now more difficult for outsiders to follow because of nested quotes, but here it goes. Your point 1 was:
I supposed this meant that the footprints in your pcb designs weren’t updated. That is expected and in line with what I said, namely that they don’t need to be updated and they are embedded in the pcb file, and what @SembazuruCDE said, namely that “footprints in existing designs (PCBnew files) aren’t automatically updated”. Did you mean something else, like that the libraries weren’t updated?
To elaborate how footprints are used in the pcb board files:
When you insert a footprint from a library to a board, the library footprint file is copied to the board file almost as it is. After that there’s no direct connection between the footprint in the board and the library. Changing the library doesn’t change the inserted footprint. This hasn’t changed between v4 and v5. The old footprints copied from v4 libraries are 100% compatible with v5. Therefore there’s no need to migrate anything.
If you want to update to possible newer versions of footprints you have to do it manually. You can open “Update Footprint” from the context menu. Then you can see the original library:name combination of the footprint. But if you click “Apply” it’s possible that a footprint with the same library:name identifier isn’t found in the new version 5 official libraries. Then you have to find the new corresponding footprint manually.
The story about the symbols in schematic is different. The naming system (not just names) for library and symbol combination was changed and therefore they need migrating to the new system. So, the “migrating” which KiCad does is different than “updating”. The inserted symbols aren’t embedded into the schematic file. Instead, they are saved in the symbol cache file. Migration creates also a rescue file which has the symbols which would otherwise get lost in the migration process (I have to say I still don’t understand the details).
I believe you will be glad you moved to version pre-5 at this point instead of doing it later, after having more and bigger projects.
You can always re-install v4 if you feel need.