What I was talking about was positioning (on the PCB) of exact postions for components which are represented on the schematic, in order to determine where (on the PCB) components of exactly that description will be placed when such components are imported (from the schematic) to the PCB. Using an array to layout a bunch of such exact locations on the PCB before importing actual components with UUIDs from the schematic would be immensely helpful.
So I could, for example, use the array tool to line up a bunch of locations for “Cherry keyswitches” and “CD74HC154 decoders” and “1n148 signal diodes” exactly the same size as the form factors selected for the components on the schematic - and then import from a schematic that has a bunch of “cherry keyswitches,” and “CD74HC154 decoders” and “1n148 signal diodes” with those same form factors that are associated with the component information from the schematic, and have those components actually land on those exact locations, associating UUIDs and PCB footprints, when imported from the schematic to the PCB.
I think you should start a new topic with a better statement of your problem, along the lines of what you just wrote. Your initial post will pissturn people off.
Sometime ago somebody mentioned software that generates keyboard layouts that are turned into KiCad layouts. I don’t remember the name. Try a search on the forum. Wait, I remember now, it’s called Ergogen.
BTW the standard terminology is symbol for schematic, and footprint for layout. And schematic is preferred to “wiring diagram”.
The schematic is a logical representation of a circuit, whereas the PCB is the physical realisation of that logic. It would be a very very niche workflow to import the footprints as they are present on the schematic. It also makes no sense in the case of multi-unit symbols. For those reasons it is not something that is likely to see development effort.
Although…
As a (very) long-time user of schematic capture software, I always thought it would be helpful if components got placed on the PCB in rough approximation to how they are drawn in the schematic. I often find that the draw the schematic in rough approximation to how the board is laid out. And, I always place decoupling capacitors next to their IC. Having to move them into position is a minor irritation.
And looking again at my schematic, I just realized that the decoders I’m using are active-low rather than active-high. This means I need to rotate the diodes attached to each and every switch one hundred eighty degrees.
Which means ungrouping them, because they are already grouped with their respective switches, and turning each and every one, one at a time, because I dastn’t do anything drastic like flipping the layer which would result in UUIDs being in new locations, even though these parts are completely interchangeable. And then grouping them again, one keyswitch at a time, so that they can be moved around with the keyswitches when I’m moving them into final positions with respect to the board layout.
That will take a little while. I wish there was a better way to do it.
Meanwhile, I will be reading the documentation for version 9 and deciding whether to confuse Debian’s update software with an out-of-distribution version that I’ll need to make some exceptions for. And on which machine, since it seems that this will require a bunch of other out-of-distribution software.
If the design is 100% repetitive, there are ways to group objects and array them, and then link them back to the schematic by name.
So, instead of flipping a zillion diodes, flip one, and then array the switch and diode where you want them.
So how you downloaded KiCad?
When I go to www.kicad.org to download KiCad I see top menu with Help-Documentation among others. When we write to read documentation we don’t suppose people need explanation that documentation is to be find at kicar.org.
I downloaded Kicad by opening a command line terminal and saying
sudo apt-get install kicad
This gets whatever version of Kicad has been verified stable and compatible with my current AMD64 hardware and Debian distribution and packaged for distribution to users.
I have read this thread and basic information that is lacking is exact number of the KiCad version.
If it is 6.0.0 than it certainly has many, many bugs. If it is 6.0.11 than it has close to 0 bugs.
I had absolutely no problems with footprint positioning with KiCad V5. But later (I don’t remember if V6 or V7) except positioning by footprint anchor positioning by any footprint pad was added and since than a problem started that you have to be careful to catch footprint by anchor (I don’t know who needs positioning by pads). I remember also reading not long ago that when you have big grid you can be even not able to catch footprint for its anchor point.
As I’m not using KiCad since some time I’m not sure if it was bug in V9 that is already fixed, or it is a consequences of some decisions made. It certainly was not about V6, but if OP uses one of beginning V6 releases and change I’m writing was made from V5 to V6 (I don’t remember it) than probability of some bug in it is relatively high.
I don’t know that (your) world. So which way you are getting a documentations of any software? Have you even read a Getting Started manual?
When in 2017 I was considering to use KiCad I have downloaded all manual pdfs and printed them to be able to read them with yellow marker in hand. Then reading a forum I got information that KiCad V4 has some problems with via stitching and shortly will be V5 with this problem solved so I decided to wait for V5 before I will design PCB with KiCad for the first time. I have spend that time on making my own libraries. When V5 came I started to use it.
I usually get documentation by looking in the ‘help’ functionality of the software itself, or at the “about” item under the help menu which is supposed to contain helpful URLs.
docs.kicad.org was not among those URLs. It definitely should have been.
From the last of which I got forwarded here. But docs.kicad.org was not there. And Debian has a nasty habit of obeying copyright law which means that unless the (usually copyrighted) documentation comes with a free-distribution license, it doesn’t get packaged.
[edit. Every last one of the URLs I gave has been transformed into the title of the page it points to by this overly helpful forum software. This leaves no way for anyone to know what the actual URLs were. I did not want forum software to do that, and wish I had been actually able to communicate what URLs I got. But I am tired and not going to invest the effort in figuring out how to turn this “feature” off. ]
Install KiCad 9 and then complain about defects in the help menu - this is already changed. It will not be fixed in 8 or any previous version even if there’s a bug (unless you pay someone to backport it, of course). 8 and below are not supported versions any more.
Searching for “kicad debian” on any search engine gives you: Install on Debian | KiCad EDA. KiCad can’t force Debian to backport new versions to the mainline package repos, even if their version becomes unsupported - they just don’t do that. That is simply how Debian works as a distro.
KiCad docs are open-source and they are in the Debian repos - you presumably haven’t installed the the kicad-doc-en package (sub in your language/s as required) : KiCad - Debian Wiki.
Install KiCad 9. Take a step back, forget your preconceptions about how things seem to work and start again. I think if you approach methodically and with reference to the documentation, you’ll find things make a lot more sense that smashing into all of PCB design face-first all at once. If you’re still unsure, ask small, focused questions, ideally with screenshots or videos and chip away at your knowledge gaps one piece at a time. This is not only basic problem solving, but also basic good manners.
Back to your original rant - KiCad does (now, at least, I have no idea about v6, that was years ago) support division in the grid text boxes (and it should work in all text boxes), it does support inches (though obviously it can’t help you to know 19.05 is 3/4 inch - that’s just general knowledge), it does come with a 1/4 inch grid in the list by default, and it does allow you to enter custom grids if you really wanted 3/4.
And the answer to the question I think you may have been trying to ask under all the tangents: you can use the “move with reference” tool to move footprints by snapping to the graphical outline. You can bind a hotkey if you use it a lot.
You can snap to pads with the normal move tool (M), and most keys have a handy NPTH right in the centre:
Amongst the FAQ items you will find a “New Member Information” article that contains several links to the “Discourse” forum software. Explanations to many basic functions of this forum can be found there, including how to post: https://forum.kicad.info/t/how-can-i-use-the-grid/61658/38
I want to say thank you to everyone who was helpful. From this thread, I got the actual location of the manual (crucial!) and some reassurance that by version 9 the things I’ve been frustrated by have in fact been addressed.
So now I just need to figure out which machine I’m going to write off from the security procedures and break the packaging system on.
I was almost sure that (in Windows) from Help menu I have access to all KiCad manuals at my HDD.
I have just checked (V8.0.9) and I am surprised seeing there only ‘Help - Getting Started with KiCad’ giving me “file… could not be found”. I have searched for them and found directory C:\Program Files\KiCad\8.0\share\doc\kicad\tutorials being empty, while I am installing each time the full installation package and certainly not switch installation manuals off, I think.
I work at PC being disconnected from net. I had to see these manuals being available directly from KiCad (with one of previous versions) or I must have dreamed it.
Separately from downloading KiCad I download all its manuals (from time to time, as they are alive) to have them ‘at hand’. But since I have read all of them (in 2017) I had no time to read them once more, what I all time have in my plans.
I read forum and I think this way I know about any new features. From time to time I see here someone loosing lot of his time looking for some weird solution to a non-existent problem just because he saved some time not reading even Getting Started manual.
And about grid.
I work (at PCB) with practically constantly grid set to 0.1mm. Sometimes I set it to 1mm (when drawing a PCB outline). I have never tried to use bigger grids.
All my footprints have courtyard rectangles placed at 0.1mm grid so working also with 0.1mm grid I position them touching each other.
Other grids happened to me to use only in Footprint Editor when positioning pads.
In your case if I were to position something in 19.05 raster I would have my grid set to 0.05mm.
I do not have the option of installing “unvetted” software on any machine which I also use for security work. Going outside what’s available from the Debian packaging system means effectively retiring one system from most other use. Getting it back for security work will mean getting a new blank SSD and installing an OS on that machine from scratch.
This is why I wanted some reassurance that it would be worth it before going and downloading the new version. So, yes, I have a reason to prefer version 6 even though you may not care about it anymore.
Anyway. I was not just “dumping on” kicad in my first post. It was actually pretty clinical, although my frustration was showing through. I went through literally every last purpose that other CAD software uses their grid system for in layout. One at a time, methodically, saying exactly what I had done and why I believed that the grid system in kicad did not (in version 6) support each of those specific purposes.
And nobody who responded told me that the grid system did in fact support any of those specific purposes and how. I am still somewhat mystified by the fact that any version of the software was ever released in which the layout grid system does not support any purpose except constraining movement, and does not even constrain movement reliably. But I am reassured that this isn’t a design philosophy and that later versions did in fact recover some of this functionality. Although no one has yet told me how, I have at least got the manual now.
As an aside, I thought the ‘array’ feature was completely useless because I could not use it to place interchangeable components. As it turns out I was wrong. Although nobody on this thread bothered to tell me about any specific use case for it, someone did direct me to a youtube video of someone who did.
Although it is completely useless for placing components it is not completely without any use case. It’s worthwhile for pins and vias and probably other things that do not have anything to do with the schematic.
I use grid to position footprint anchor ‘in grid’ and nothing more. From your first post I understood that you expected top-left courtyard border will be positioned in grid what from my point of view is absolutely senseless. Courtyard can be smaller/bigger if you want less/more margin around your footprint. Positioning based on it…
The problem with V6 for me is that:
V5 was ‘current’ for 3 years.
When V6 came at the same time something was changed (in Python as I remember, no KiCad developers intention) what make V6 not to be used at Win7 PC. It took me more than half year to move with all my work to Win10. So I was using V5 for almost 4 years and V6 for few months.
I remember nothing what is specific for V6.
Have you looked through settings. May be there is something restricting move only to step being grid multiple. If so then if you have footprint off grid it will always be off grid.
