OpenGL canvas Update

Yes, of course, but the problem was that, at least right now, when KiCad pre-v5 is installed and it replaces v4, the new footprint libraries are installed, but the global fp-lib-table isn’t updated and there’s not even a warning about it. This may be fixed somehow, considering the developer discussion which is going on, but it’s not a simple or rare issue. It affects everyone who updates KiCad from 4 to 5. Whether they are using the official libraries as starting point or not.

Thanks, Eelik. And thank you for clarifying your status as “not a developer”.

Of course, I agree: newcomers should not be expected to know the entire history of the Forum(s) of KiCad or any other software (which is something I stated previously)

And for the record, although Maui seems to be interpreting that I am “blaming” others, I am not blaming, although perhaps Maui is feels that it’s blame. What I am doing is putting my usage / choices / steps or history, in context.

Eelik is spot-on when he says “really should be so much automated that …”; Again, in my opinion also it is very reasonable to expect a “new” installation to perform all basic functions from the starting gate. That includes Beta versions or ‘nightlies’. A “new installation” should, in my opinion include the situation of performing an Uninstall of one version, and the installation of a new version (i.e., the user shouldn’t have to nuke-and-pave to get a virgin platform on which to build the installation).

Insofar as the sometimes repeated remarks about ‘nobody really needs a 3d version of the board’, well, I guess those who have made such comments have never tried to fit long, skinny boards into tubular pressure housings of geophysical instruments getting plunged several km into a borehole— a task where the overall board layout is often dictated by the component packages, not by the desire to have a simple 1 or 2 layers board and efficient routing. In other words, taller components often have to be placed along the centerline just to make them fit, and the board may have to be >2 layers (with blind vias) just to get the necessary level of routing options.

I have my own libraries and templates; I update the fp-lib-table when I need to add or remove libraries to my personal db…
I updates my libraries when I need to add or change my symbols or footprints… No big issue if the format of the libraries doesn’t change… (that is the only risky part to be aware of)
I don’t see many issue if you know how the sw is working and what to do with it…
And just to remember you, v5 is not even released… after the release there will be a transition period in which all (most of) these glitches will be fixed because many users will spot those … that happened in the past from kicad v3 to v4 and it will happen again from v5 to v6 …

Yes, but it’s better to catch them before the release. And a couple of glitches have been caught here. I don’t see any reason to blame the original poster. He(?) may have made some mistakes in communication, but communication goes in two directions, and even in this discussion there are more than one party who are guilty of imperfect communication… Me included.

That should be “Myself included.”

:wink: :smiley: :stuck_out_tongue:

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Because it really was not all that hard for me to do. And, when considering the feature benefits in the nightlies, even the V4 nightlies, it still seems to me a “no-brainer” to step directly into V5 at this time.

V4 and V5 handle the libraries differently. It does not make sense for me to recommend that a beginner learn V4, only to have to relearn a totally new system in a short period of time in the future.

Standard nightly disclaimers apply. However, I’d bet that those on this forum would be prompt to help find a solution to any issue encountered when respectfully asking for technical help (the 100+ replies already demonstrate this). Another benefit is that other new users will be able to search the forum for a solution in the situation where the documentation may be a bit lacking, which is perfectly normal for open-source software.

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@von_Whimhurst Do you have a specific issue that you need technical help with? And, I suggest you create a new thread if it is not OpenGL canvas related.

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After having tried many times to tell him why the libraries have the actual structure, the poster said:

and if you go through the thread, you can see that he complained many time about developers and librarians choices and documentation, and he complained of not being heard, but he refused to spend time to go through the forum to understand why the libraries are structured like they are now. And even refused to raise his complaint to the developers mailing list, which is the place, eventually, to ask for changes or report issues.
So: who is blaming who?


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In no place did I “refuse” to do anything. The word “refuse” is one highly loaded with negative emotion and I respectfully suggest sticking to the facts:

  1. In the context that we ended up discussing breaking news / revelations about a “nightly” prequel to v5, researching old Forum notes would’ve been an irrational thing to do.
  2. Am I on the developer’s mailing list? No, I am not. That membership is not automatic; it is a closed group that requires invitation. Did anybody invite me to “become a Developer”? No. How am I to post any mail to a closed group before I am invited to join?

And I am sorry that you (and perhaps most…) obviously didn’t appreciate my sense of humour: the *.hal file extension was suggested with allusion to the HAL 9000 computer that ran amok in Kubrick’s 1968 movie classic, 2001: A Space Odyssey

John, thanks for taking the time to write this reply.

I’m not used to using Git so it will take some effort to get used to the routines (work flow). Hopefully, Microsoft takeover of GitHub will not change and complicate any of that!

I’d be happy to contribute any number of models to the KiCad project. At some point, I am sure that I will need some pointers on the workflow that you outlined and, if it’s OK with you, I will just message you directly.

that is your point of view, with our without your bold characters.

You may not admit, but joining the dev mailing list is the only concrete way to get in contact with developers and discuss ideas or whatever you consider important:


You may try to change again what you said, but *.hal was intended as ‘hallucination’

Yes, it is both a hallucination and it is also an allusion to HAL.

A file without any content is a hallucination in the sense that you think something is there, but there is nothing there. I could have used the equivalents: Illusion, or Mirage. But instead I chose Hallucination because it could be abbreviated as a *.hal file extension which was reminiscent of HAL 9000 which had famously run amok to protect itself, and so posed grave problems for the crew.

If the development team feels it best to have a pre-filled file-name, by all means, go ahead and do that (I understand the rationale viz: pull orders)----but at least put some meaningful data into the file so that users can see what that file is, and what it is not—so that users are not running around trying to find the missing file, or left scratching their noggins, wondering if their configuration has gone wonky.

I have created a *.step file and a *.wrl as a suggested, common file to drop into every one of these “placeholder files,” instead of leaving the file empty.
hal_tag.wrl (76.4 KB)
And, I quickly created a bogus PROJect with two ferrite core torroidal inductors; the footprint for the part presently has one of these “prefilled” (but empty) placeholders, which I have substituted with the hal_tag.wrl :

Or perhaps

Some of the topics covered in this post, are examined further at:

Long thread guys. So far so good. Respect for keeping it civil in here.

Some observation notes though…

Please be aware that people get protective about ‘their baby’ after they have put in thought and heartblood, not to speak of time they could have spent with something else.
So if you state - even oblivious shortcomings - be aware that without their work you couldn’t even talk about those things and what you consider a make-or-brake feature/problem for most of the people making these things runs in the ignore-for-now-or-good-enough category.

Also, as has been pointed out this is a support forum first and foremost. While we have devs attending and have no problem hosting discussions of KiCAD features etc. we’re the wrong place to actually get things done.

Don’t work yourself up over this, it’s definitely not worth it.

just one PR and I tag that badge back on, promised :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye:

Thanks, Joan, for the respectful comments.

I do understand, now, that although folks in the Dev team are often here, this is not the platform (forum) for suggesting or discussing changes.
And speaking of such things, perhaps someone could comment on the status and uses for the Yahoo-hosted KiCad forum…I visited there but it seems to be a bit, well, dusty (from disuse).
In your comment to Eelik, what is “PR” ?

PR = Pull request. The process of sharing your stuff with the core team. (The term pull request comes from github and similar services. The old way of doing it was by sending out patches by email. This way is still used for the source code of kicad.)

Ahh. Thanks for the clarification. :grinning:

Yahoo and their ilk is the reason I learned to set up my own mailing list and forum software. I rather quickly became a fan of this sites underlying software once I started using it.

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